Vanderbilt Cup Races

Wayne, you’re correct.  Another locator was that the engine was very close to the old puppet theater (~100 yards NE?).  The tracks were still in place with rails in the pavement on Merrick in that 1956 Art Huneke photo linked above and the leading Gerosa tractor is sitting across them, facing south (note the old station building visible to the NW, at left past the truck’s radiator).  Sam, III

From Kleiner's Kolumn: Documentation of the Long Island Motor Parkway Bridges in Nassau County (#28-#42)

Rene Simon was part of the Moisant International Aviators, a “barnstorming” group of early pilots (founded by brothers John & Alfred Moisant) who toured the south and west for around 5 months during late 1910 and early 1911. There is a reference to a Bleriot XI (with 50 HP. Gnome motor) racing a Packard in New Orleans on Dec. 30, 1910. I’m attaching a photo taken at the Houston Airshow (Jan. 27 - 30, 1911) which shows Joe Seymour on the left and Rene Simon 3rd. from the left. I’m thinking that since New Orleans is not all that far from Houston, Simon and Seymour duplicated the event at the old race track in Houston in January, 1911. By this time, Seymour was becoming interested in f lying as well as auto racing after participating in the 1908 and 1909 Vanderbilt Cup Races.

From Mystery Foto #9 Solved: A Bleriot Monoplane Racing a Vanderbilt Cup Racer in 1910/1911

Great work, Art; thanks.  Yeeks!  I worked for many years on New Highway backing on Adventurers (110) and was all over the Ruland/Maxess/Duryea area and never realized (back then) the significance of it, LIMP-wise.  But then that applies to much of western and central Nassau as well.  Until Bob Miller introduced me to the LIMP history (thanks, Bob), I must have missed endless chances for documentation; rats!  Sam, III

From Kleiner's Kolumn:Documentation of the Eight Motor Parkway Bridges in Suffolk County (#53 to #60)

Howard, Rene Simon and Joe Seymour were two of the seven man Moisant International Aviators group formed by John B. Moisant in 1910. The plane is a 1909 Bleriot. In January 1911 the group put on a show in Houston Texas I think that is were the photo was taken because the show was put on at a closed down race track. A Joe Seymore raced a Fiat in 1907.  A similar auto/plane race was planned on Long Island in September that year on and over local public roads around Garden City. Lou Disbrow in a National automobile and Tom Sopwith piloting a Bleriot. When the Nassau County sheriff forbade it the question was raised why not hold it on and over the privately owned Long Island Motor Parkway? We know it didn’t happen, I guess Willie wasn’t in the mood for any kind of racing.

From Mystery Foto #9 Solved: A Bleriot Monoplane Racing a Vanderbilt Cup Racer in 1910/1911

Joe Seymour raced in the 1908 and 1909 Vanderbilt Cup races.
Rene Simon was a daredevil piilot who flew this Moisant monoplane and other aircraft.
Moisant had a plant in Garden City.
My guess would be this race took place in July 1911 with Seymour in #16 on a stretch of the LIMP through Levittown.

From Mystery Foto #9 Solved: A Bleriot Monoplane Racing a Vanderbilt Cup Racer in 1910/1911

I agree that it will fetch a high dollar. Amazing rig.

Will be there to watch it cross the block.

From Update: A Renault Vanderbilt Racer was Sold Today at the Amelia Island Auction

Making a guess here, but could be from Hutchinson, Kansas Air Show featuring the Moisant International Aviators.  Joe Seymour was not only a race driver but also a flyer for Moisant.  The attached Newpaper articles give details about both Seymour and Simon as well as the plane.  The dates for this show are April 13, 14 and 15 of 1911.

From Mystery Foto #9 Solved: A Bleriot Monoplane Racing a Vanderbilt Cup Racer in 1910/1911

Thanks Art for this historical account of the LIMP near my childhood home of few blocks from this location. I always learn something new here and in this case I was unaware of the 1976 auction. I would love to know why Levitt didn’t acquire those lots. Thankfully the community stood firmly against high density housing which would have been a big mistake. I have a feeling that you are keeping those property posts safe at your home.

From Kleiner's Korner: The Long Island Motor Parkway and Levittown

This is great stuff! I love the relics found along the site. That racing car reminds me of the plastic models sold at Freeport Raceway. The models are of late 30’s cars so probably not from the Vanderbilt races. As far as the selling off of Motor Parkway property is concerned, how does that impact the adjacent LIRR ROW? The Motor Parkway property is in the hands of Nassau County while the LIRR ROW is in the hands of the MTA and therefore NY State. Once again, a great job with this site!

From Kleiner's Korner: The Long Island Motor Parkway and Levittown

I looked at a Google map and #35 was actually placed about 1400 ft south of the RR ROW. The old ROW runs just north of the lake. I have vivid memories of the engine in the open field just south of the old clubhouse or Lannin House directly adjacent to Merrick Ave. You may have a point about using a shoo-fly track to get the engine and tender directly in from Merrick Ave. It would have been precarious for those trucks and cranes to try to drive over and set up on a grassy field.

From Kleiner's Kolumn: Documentation of the Long Island Motor Parkway Bridges in Nassau County (#28-#42)

So Howard, when will the Renault make it’s debut on Long Island roads again? It would look great in your collection! You can only have a race when ole Number 8 has a mate!
Best Regards,
Scott & Vicki

From Update: A Renault Vanderbilt Racer was Sold Today at the Amelia Island Auction

-Provide background information on participants Rene Simon and Joe Seymour and their connections

René Simon (December 8, 1885 – April 21, 1947) was a French aviator. He toured the United States in 1911-12 with the Moisant International Aviators. He became known for daring tactics and was called the Flying-Fool by the public. Joe Seymour participated in two Vanderbilt Cup Races; finishing 8th in the 1908 race and 10th in the 1909 race.

-Identify the airplane and the likely race car

The plane was a Bleriot XI. A plane that VCR driver Hubert LeBlon and 1st female pilot Harriet Quimby both perished in at different times at flying events. A neat Bleriot XI replica can be seen in the main terminal at MacArthur airport in Islip. The Vanderbilt Racer could have been a Thomas or an Isotta being those are what Seymour drove in the Vanderbilt Cup Races. Although the Thomas is unlikely since it had 60hp and not the 120hp stated in the photo’s caption.

-Link the airplane to the Long Island Motor Parkway

I’m seeing many round about connections, but having a tough time finding a direct connection.

-Kudos question: When and where was the Mystery Foto taken? Since the answer is currently unknown, a list of possible options is acceptable.

Attached are some newspaper advertisements for the Moisant International Aviators event in Fort Worth Texas on Jan 12th & 13th, 1911. The mystery photo can be seen in the advertisements, so I do not believe it was from that Texas event, but a previous event possibly a few weeks or months earlier. Moisant Int. Aviators toured across the US, Mexico and Cuba and was formed in Oct 1910. This mystery photo was absolutely taken sometime between Oct 1910 and Jan 1911.

From Mystery Foto #9 Solved: A Bleriot Monoplane Racing a Vanderbilt Cup Racer in 1910/1911

I’m covering sale of this Renault at Bonhams for Sports Car Market magazine. I don’t want to guess at sale price, but if anyone has additional information about this car please comment, or write me at .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address).

From Update: A Renault Vanderbilt Racer was Sold Today at the Amelia Island Auction

In Gary Hammond’s June 5th 1950 photo at the bottom is what still left of the LIMP a small curving turn into Clinton Ave. that Howard had brought up in a previous time, last year? about saving this section as historical landmark site.

From Mystery Foto #8 Solved: A 1951 Aerial View of Mitchel Field & the Motor Parkway & 2017 Circus Trains

Sam, I would agree that at some point #35 had to leave the rails. I used that same picture that you referenced. #35 was placed for exhibit (I climbed it many times as a child) about a hundred yards south of the RR ROW in the picnic area next to the old clubhouse. I have no idea how it got to that place or from where via the lo-boy. One thing did just occur to me. If the picture is indeed 1956 then the Meadowbrook Parkway would already have bisected the RR so it did not come from the adjacent tracks.

From Kleiner's Kolumn: Documentation of the Long Island Motor Parkway Bridges in Nassau County (#28-#42)

Exciting race!

From Mystery Foto #9 Solved: A Bleriot Monoplane Racing a Vanderbilt Cup Racer in 1910/1911

Lee - where “east of the Park” on Stewart could A&P have moved, please?  It’s all residential and light commercial.  Sam, III

From Mystery Foto #8 Solved: A 1951 Aerial View of Mitchel Field & the Motor Parkway & 2017 Circus Trains

Wayne, I have a vague recollection that #35 was pushed in from Merrick Avenue on a temporary shoo-fly track, NOT on CRR track.  It came by Gerosa lo-boy flat-bed truck in June 1956 as you note - the photo is at <https://www.arrts-arrchives.com/CEXT7.html>.  Sam, III

From Kleiner's Kolumn: Documentation of the Long Island Motor Parkway Bridges in Nassau County (#28-#42)

Addendum: General Bronze would relocate to Florida in 1966.  The A&P Warehouse would move further east on Stewart Ave., east of the Park about the same time.

From Mystery Foto #8 Solved: A 1951 Aerial View of Mitchel Field & the Motor Parkway & 2017 Circus Trains

While I have seen no specific dates but you can draw conclusions from related events that are documented.
Salisbury Park became a county park in 1949. Nassau took over the Salisbury Golf Club property for non payment of taxes. 1949 maps of the new county park show the LIRR ROW going through the park. The original tracks through that area were probably torn up for the war effort in the early 1940’s. The tracks would have then ended at the Salisbury Plains station just west of Merrick Road. Passenger service to Salisbury Plains (via a shuttle from Garden City) ended in the mid 1940’s. In 1948, the railroad relayed track eastward, through the park, to an area behind the now NUMC to deliver building supplies for Levittown. Those deliveries lasted as late as April of 1951. Photos from 1952 show the delivery sidings still in place but obviously not in use judging by their condition. Another photo shows the June 1956 delivery of steam engine 35 for static display at the park. The track is still across Merrick Ave but appears to end right at the park side of the road. So, I would say that the final track was removed from Salisbury Park sometime between 1952 and 1956,  probably closer to the 1952 time frame.

From Kleiner's Kolumn: Documentation of the Long Island Motor Parkway Bridges in Nassau County (#28-#42)