Vanderbilt Cup Races

From my Automotive page <http://sbiii.com/automotv.html>, “There was a fellow somewhere on the central East Coast who only drove air-cooled Franklins.  He had a barn full of them in various states of repair and he believed in distilling and decanting his oil; to my knowledge, this took out all the ‘good stuff’ and left sludge, but he swore by the gook which resulted and the cars ran just fine.  This is no mere apocryphal note; I was there!” and “Dr. William Dohm (not Doehm), a veterinarian in Roslyn, Long Island, drove a 1933 Franklin Olympic sedan as his every-day car well into the ‘60s or ‘70s; his favorite trick was to start the car cold and drive it directly up the eastbound Northern Boulevard (25A) hill (very long and steep) in top gear without even warming it up or shifting down, which the car did without even hesitating!  That car was last known to be up here in Massachusetts” (as of 25 Jul 2017) and I thanked some noted automotive historian named Walt Gosden for details about Dr. Dohm’s car.  Sam, III

From The Winning Thomas Flyer at the Long Island Automotive Museum

Austin Clark never had any restoration work done to the Thomas, he left it as he found and purchased it. Bill Harrah had the car restored in his shops in Nevada. For years George Schuster doubted that the car was the one he used in the race and it drove Austin crazy. Austin even offered to go get Schuster at his home upstate and drive him out to see the car etc to confirm but Schuster refused to do that convinced he was right. Well after Bill Harrah bought the car from Austin Schuster finally agreed to a trip ( fee vacation was attractive???) and when shown the car at Harrah’s and the repairs to the chassis that were made during the race finally said ” oh yeah it is the real car, imagine that”, This really annoyed Austin no end - for decades Schuster couldn’t bother to go see the car and when he did it was more then half way across the USA.  I can not describe Austin’s words about that injustice on Schuster’s part to even go have a look. Bill Harrah never understood that either as Bill and I were friends due to his interest in Franklin automobiles. We spoke of it at the Franklin Club annual meet in central NY and at Hershey and Bill would just shake his head and not know why . Austin and Bill had great respect for each other. I still have a number of Christmas cards that I received from Bill ( and his assorted companions of the particular year) that we would exchange. Every year for over a decade we would spend the week at the Franklin meet driving around with the rest of the group there. He brought 3 or 4 cars out from Reno for that meet and until I had my own Franklin there was told - pick which one you want to drive for the week.

From The Winning Thomas Flyer at the Long Island Automotive Museum

Of all the period photographs I have seen by Nathan Lazernick or Spooner & Wells all of them had the photographers named rubber stamped on the back , usually with a small mention that credit should be given to them if used , since most were done for use in the newspapers of that era.

From VanderbiltCupRaces.com Exclusive: High-Resolution Photos of the 1906 Vanderbilt Cup Race

Christie front wheel drive. At the loft in the Long Island Automotive museum was the hood for the taxi that Christie made. Not sure where Austin got it from, but I recall several people - myself included , stumbling over it in the dark loft as we searched for parts and lamps and “stuff” to buy on Iron Range Days.

From Mystery Foto #13 Solved: A Unique 1906 Transverse V-4 Christie Front-Wheel Drive Engine

Wonderful photos and a video have been added from Schen Photography.

From Update:Tucker 1044 Highlights from the Simeone Museum's Tucker Day

Further to my comment re smoke, take a look at HK’s Sep 2005 “CAR COMING” poster (and the cars haven’t even started yet!).  Sam, III

From VanderbiltCupRaces.com Exclusive: High-Resolution Photos of the 1906 Vanderbilt Cup Race

Once again w/o cheating, I’ll bet that’s J. Walter Christie’s transverse front-drive engine in a rare rear-quarter view!  Sam, III

From Mystery Foto #13 Solved: A Unique 1906 Transverse V-4 Christie Front-Wheel Drive Engine

Bruce and Gary - looks more like a burning clutch facing but it’s far more likely to be just plain old 1906 engine exhaust as Le Diable Rouge (“The Red Devil”) accelerated coming out of the curve.  Sam, III

From VanderbiltCupRaces.com Exclusive: High-Resolution Photos of the 1906 Vanderbilt Cup Race

Whoops!  I think I may have scrambled recollections of the Thomas with one of Pershing’s two or three dual-rear-tired Locomobiles, the one on display at the old Ordnance Museum at Aberdeen Proving Ground.  I can’t remember which was at APG but one was a 1914 and the other one of two 1919 Model 48 Overseas models.  Sam, III

From The Winning Thomas Flyer at the Long Island Automotive Museum

I have very fond memories of seeing the Thomas Flyer at Austin Clark’s museum on my many visits there.  To me, it’s a shame that Bill Harrah had the car restored.  I preferred seeing it in its original state.
Rog

From The Winning Thomas Flyer at the Long Island Automotive Museum

I notice in the vintage ad above that there was also a Roslyn Motors facility in Flushing, Queens. Does anyone have any information on where it was?. Was it a showroom? How long was it in operation?

From Updated 2/21/18: Mystery Foto #7 Solved: The Roslyn Motors Lincoln Dealership in 1926

Jan Hyde:

Great day at one of my favorite places!

From Update:Tucker 1044 Highlights from the Simeone Museum's Tucker Day

This is the Christie WC-3, also known as the WC-1906. It was built for the 1906 Vanderbilt Cup but was destroyed in the September time trials. The engine was a 100 bhp V4, not the straight 4 configuration of earlier Christies. Walter Christie, Louis Strang as riding mechanic, crashed and destroyed the car during the time trials when another car spun in front of them and Christie ran off the road, hitting a tree. The car could not be repaired in time for the 1906 race, so Christies quickly stripped and prepared a 50 bhp straight 4 touring car for the race. This car was underpowered for the event and finished way down, but it did finish. The car in the photo never ran in the Vanderbilt Cup race itself.

[i tried to send a response earlier but was suffering internet problems so not sure it transmitted]

From Mystery Foto #13 Solved: A Unique 1906 Transverse V-4 Christie Front-Wheel Drive Engine

Hi Howard. I just finished rereading Julie Fenster’s detailed account of the 1908 “race of the century”. At the end of the book she does not mention that the Thomas was purchased by Austin Clark which I find interesting. She states that its “provenance is a little disjointed” following the sale of the car by the publisher of the “Buffalo Commercial” newspaper. The last picture that you posted is the condition of the car as I remember it at Clark’s museum, so he must have had the car restored to its appearance at the end of the race. I also had the opportunity some years ago of seeing the Protos in the Deutsches Museum in Munich.

From The Winning Thomas Flyer at the Long Island Automotive Museum

This is Walter Christie’s 1906 race car, which he developed through the year with the hope of winning the Vanderbilt Cup.  It was fast, equaling Barney Oldfield’s one mile American oval track record of 53 seconds. Unfortunately Walter crashed on September 15, while practicing for the Elimination Trial.  Walter then stripped down one of his touring cars for the race.  It had maybe half the horsepower of this racing engine, but he still qualified for the Vanderbilt Cup and finished 13th. His fastest lap was 33 minutes, compared to the leaders who turned 28 minute laps.  The fastest cars in the 1906 Vanderbilt Race had nearly 120hp. Due to the accident, Christie was racing with his production car of only 50hp.
Attached is a photo from the Henry Ford Collection, showing the car and engine from a very similar angle. Also attached is a photo of his wrecked race car, with the engine shown in your photo.

From Mystery Foto #13 Solved: A Unique 1906 Transverse V-4 Christie Front-Wheel Drive Engine

Looks like a front drive Christie.

From Mystery Foto #13 Solved: A Unique 1906 Transverse V-4 Christie Front-Wheel Drive Engine

Sam, just to let you know I was at the Simeone Museum event the other day, had with me of the print outs of what you want to see in a large envelope, thrust to Howard on way his out to the Demo event of the day, he quickly put it in bag, so I’m not sure if he got to see it? thrown out? He’s a very busy guy these days. As for scanning, have to learn quickly, maybe to you sbiii.com?
HEY HOWARD, SAM WANT TO SEE THOSE PRINT OUTS! Your groupie Mark
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Howard Kroplick

Mark, great to see you yesterday in Philly. Thanks for the information! John will scan and will post later in the week.

From Sad News: The buildings of the Long Island Automotive Museum are gone

Was that a blown head gasket shot?

Bruce, that’s a premonition of the Chrysler influence one-hundred years back to the future.

From VanderbiltCupRaces.com Exclusive: High-Resolution Photos of the 1906 Vanderbilt Cup Race

I always under the impression that George Schuster was the winning driver of the NY to Paris race in 1908.
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Howard Kroplick

Schuster and Roberts split the driving for the Thomas Flyer during the 1908 Race.

From The Winning Thomas Flyer at the Long Island Automotive Museum

Engine shown in photo is the 50 hp Christie. Car competed in the 1907 Vanderbilt Cup. Running in 5th place when Elimination Trials were called on 9th lap. Running in 13th when race was called 8th lap. Engine had V shaped placement of cylinders permitting larger diameter pistons to be divided into 2 banks of two cylinders for each side. This allowed a larger power bore.

From Mystery Foto #13 Solved: A Unique 1906 Transverse V-4 Christie Front-Wheel Drive Engine