Vanderbilt Cup Races

Dave, hard to tell with these fuzzy photos but quite possibly could have been two creases (photo sent to Howard). In the old photo, the inner west abutment shows the first crease about ~10 inches from the top, then second crease (the bottom of the cap [crown]) about ~3 feet. The east abutment photo showed only smooth wall (fuzzy photo). In your video of the west abutment, the 10 inch crease can be seen early but then is interrupted with a lower crack produced over time, then returns 10 inches towards the south end of the west abutment. The location of the sturdy sign at the north end (very beginning of same video) is smooth without creases. This can be the most likely location of the sign. The video you and Sammy provided has opened more channels for solving the mystery behind the Mayan Ruins. Always love to see your adventures.

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

Amazing!! Thank you for sharing!! Can we do group trips?

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

That’s Alice Huyler Ramsey who, in 1909 at the age of 22, became the first woman to drive cross country from New York to California. The owner of the car, a 1909 4-cylinder 30HP Maxwell DA, was the manufacturer Maxwell-Briscoe Company who sponsored the trip as an advertising / promotional event. I believe the photo was taken on June 9, 1909, the day she started her historic journey. She was accompanied by her two sisters-in-law: Margaret Atwood and Nettie Powell and friend Hermine Jahns, although she was the only driver. Her link to Long Island is that prior to her coast-to-coast ride, she drove in a 200 mile endurance ride from her home in Hackensack, NJ to Montauk and back. The Chrysler link is that in 1926 Maxwell-Briscoe was absorbed into Walter Chrysler’s company.

From Mystery Foto #1 Solved:Alice Huyler Ramsey & Her Maxwell Prior to Her 1909 Transcontinental Journey

Brian: Love you man but I completely disagree!!

Look at the old pictures. From the top of the abutment to the “crease” there has to be at least 3 feet before the crease. Now look at my pictures, there is only like 8-10” there. It’s not the same! And there are no other “creases” in the abutments pictures so it’s not like we can be confusing it with any other “creases”. I honestly don’t think these are the abutments.

Next—-if this were the abutment, you see in the old pictures those things are at least 12-14 feet tall. The remaining wall is only about 2 feet tall. It can’t be that 10-12 feet of that abutment are underground! No way!

And about a block away at the Jasper house the original road pavement is right there in his backyard at present elevation. From this “abutment” location to the Jasper backyard - if in fact the abutments were buried, there would ABSOLUTELY be a noticeable elevation drop from the abutments there to the original pavement in his backyard. I’m totally convinced now that these are NOT the abutments!!

A date stamp would settle everything, but looking at the old pics I don’t even see that there was a date stamp on the abutments.

Art—-great pics on your site. I recall you telling me you knew those people but I assumed you were talking about the ones who lived in the house that I went to. You know the other side with the vines on their wall.

And I will join you with the shovel when you want to go and dig! I also think the pavement is there, but it wouldn’t take long to find it. I think we would only have to go down 6-12” before we found it because I don’t believe those are the abutments. Cant be!!!

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

P.S.:  The car accident in the old photo at Mayan Ruin bridge was the result of its right-rear rim/tire coming off the vehicle causing it to turn over. Two occupants of the vehicle, a man and woman, were rushed to Flushing Hospital by a passerby. The extent of injuries were unknown as written on a report by Motor Parkway Police Officer Thomas Zinzi on Aug 19, 1928. Zinzi’s motorcycle is seen in both photos.
http://www.vanderbiltcupraces.com/blog/article/vanderbiltcupraces.com_exclusive_thomas_j._zinzi_the_first_motor_parkway_po

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

Great find again Sam and Dave. Always fun reading about your LIMP adventures.

And good point Dave. I’m guessing today’s protruding walls in GC are most likely just the bridge abutment caps (highest point) as seen in the Suffolk County Vanderbilt Museum photos provided by Al Velocci. Also I agree with Brian McCarthy of the converging slopes being the lowest point under the bridge, as well as the creased caps on top of the abutments. Being just the caps in GC, one would not have to dig deep here before revealing the top of the indented wall below. I don’t see caps on the lower outer walls in Al’s photos, and their heights are much lower than the abutments allowing them to be entirely buried first. I’m estimating there’s 9-10 feet of dirt (at its deepest) before reaching the parkway down below, by subtracting how much wall is exposed today from its actual height in the photo. A lot of dirt was once delivered here!

One other thing; in the old photo there’s a sturdy bridge sign placed on the cap, on the north side of the inner west abutment just before it slopes down 45 degrees. I believe you were facing south while filming the video (guessing it was afternoon by the shadows). At the very beginning of the video (0:00), the inner cap just left of the 45 degree slope shows a smooth surface with no crease compared to the rest of the wall, indicating where the sign was once positioned. It’s been years since I’ve visited here and will have to go back for more fun soon.

That’s my two cents. Anyone, please chime in at will. Corrections gladly accepted here.

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

Mystery Foto#1….Alice Huyler Ramsey was the driver and the car was provided by the Maxwel-Briscoe Motor company. Photo was taken in 1909 when she did her cross-country trip. The car was a Maxwell Model 30. Alice was the first woman to drive across the U.S. coast to coast. The Long Island link is that Alice was at a 1908 auto rally on L.I. when a Maxwell executive asked her if she would like to drive the company’s new 30 hp, four cylinder Maxwell across the country to prove that the car could make it and that a female motorist could do it. The Vanderbilt Cup connection is that Eddie Rickenbacker drove a Maxwell in the 1917 Cup race. The Maxwell company was reorganized into Chrysler Corp. by Walter Chrysler on June 6, 1925.  And as a post script some of us may remember that Jack Benny occasionally spoke of his Maxwell on his TV show way back when..

From Mystery Foto #1 Solved:Alice Huyler Ramsey & Her Maxwell Prior to Her 1909 Transcontinental Journey

i’m the first employee of the auto mesuem.its sad to see the museum in such bad shape.we will never see another museum like it ever again on long island,but there are many great cars out east in garages,and you see some at auto shows out here.I think only old farts enjoy the old buggies.there is a curved dash olds at the riverhead historical museum like was over the entrance to the museum.Swede Edwards a historian of the museum died last year,he also worked at the museum,and has many pictures of some of austie’s cars.he owned the radiator shop accross from the museum.my first car was a model t

                            have a great new year   Gene Martin

From Hamptons Road Trip: A 1928 Renault Barn Find & Site of the Long Island Automotive Museum Up for Sale

Art
  Good job on that find and hope you explore more to find what might be their

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

Alice Ramsey in 1909 in front of her Maxwell auto,
She drove this auto across the country, the first woman to do so.
She also participated in the Montauk Point endurance run.
The auto was provided by Carl Kelsey, sales manager for Maxwell.
Maxwell was later absorbed by Chrysler.

From Mystery Foto #1 Solved:Alice Huyler Ramsey & Her Maxwell Prior to Her 1909 Transcontinental Journey

Just adding my gratitude to the list . Many thanks for this great site and its content…

From The Top Twenty-Five 2016 Posts on VanderbiltCupRaces.com

Great historic photos with the greats included. Glad to see they’re all preserved for future generations to view and learn from, a remarkable feat by itself that was well worth the effort. Please keep these coming!

From Mystery Fotos #42 Solved: A 1948 Picnic at Lowell Thomas' Home in Pawling, New York

Dave, glad you found it.  Both sides of the unbuilt bridge are shown on my website link below.  I’m fortunate to work with the daughter of the homeowner on whose property lies the east abutment and who has invited me to explore a few times.  I always tell him that one day he’s going to wake up and find me with a backhoe digging up the parkway between the abutments.  Its got to be there.

http://www.freewebs.com/limparkway/gardencityunbuiltbridge.htm

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

I’m back. Now I see the “lower walls” that are on each side of both abutments, Dave. After watching your video clip, I’m convinced those lower walls are buried. On the older photos of the abutments, there’s a “crease” maybe 1 and 1/2 ft down from the top. And then on each side of the abutments, the concrete angles downwards. In the beginning of your video, I definitely see the “crease” and angled concrete. I don’t know if you measured the height of the exposed abutments, but guessing their 2 and 1/2 to 3 ft high? Knowing how high they are not terribly important.

I wonder if your next adventure is exploring the southside of the past Old Country Rd underpass. Probably need a shovel for that one. We’ll get the Oak Island Team over their!

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

Great coverage of this area, Dave and Sam!

The original grade of the LIMP north and south of this unfinished bridge is peculiar. There’s definitely an uprise due north, and also an uprise due south. There had to be quite a low point in the road at this location. I guess this would’ve provided ample clearance for a finished bridge.

Comparing the original and your current photos, it’s clear to me that the flat walls and slopes are quite evident on the east and west sides.

After the LIMP was abandoned, this slope had to be buried/leveled for the future housing. I remember Jaspers LIMP section when inspecting the steel towers, etc. Nice and level, like a backyard patio. When I would walk/patrol thru these backyards, you can tell where the LIMP was buried. Either the ground level would be a bit high or low, right up to Old Country Rd.

Always look forward to your travels and findings, Dave and Sam!

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

The car is the Carl Kelsey sponsored Maxwell which did the 1909 cross continent drive by this woman, Alice Huyler Ramsey, and three female companions.  The photo is taken some time after that event in 1909 as the snow is on the ground(though the car has a 1908 license plate, were they one and done or renewed every year?  That may blow a hole in the book caption I have).  The drive began from NY on June 9 and ended August 6, 1909 in San Francisco.  The Maxwell Junior automobile was purchased for her by her husband, future NJ Congressman John Rathbone Ramsey, because of her inability to control a horse.

The only Vanderbilt Cup race connection I can find with her is her having been seen off in New York by Joan Newton Cuneo, a more famous lady racer who’s driving coach/mechanic was Louis Disbrow who drove in the Vanderbilt Cup races. 

The Maxwell automobile was manufactured in Tarrytown NY and somehow morphed into Chrysler….so that’s not a LI connection….ah….here tis…..“Maxwell entered racers in the 1906 American Elimination Trial, and the 1908, 1909, 1910 Sweepstakes associated with the Vanderbilt Cup Races. No Maxwells participated in the Vanderbilt Cup Races held on Long Island from 1904 to 1910.”-from the Vanderbilt Cup Races site. 

From Mystery Foto #1 Solved:Alice Huyler Ramsey & Her Maxwell Prior to Her 1909 Transcontinental Journey

“What an incredible history!!!  Thank you so very much for sharing these beautiful photo’s with information for all to enjoy.  I moved to Pawling when I was around two yrs. old (1946) from Montrose. PA.  My Dad worked for Pawling Rubber Co. , Glen Arden Farm and Sheffield Farms.  I remember vaguely attending picnic hosted by Lowell Thomas and Raymond Thornberg (married to Lowell Thomas’ sister Pherbia).  Wish I had photo’s to share from this lovely time.”  Sharon Boo

From Mystery Fotos #42 Solved: A 1948 Picnic at Lowell Thomas' Home in Pawling, New York

This was a very interesting find. Amazing that this is still here.

Maybe we can start a little discussion here: looking at the old photos, it is clear that you have the bridge abutments, but then north and south of the abutments you have a small wall. I’m wondering now if the remaining remnants shown in my pictures are of this small wall, and not the bridge abutments???

If it were the abutment it would be the upper portion of the abutment which means, why did they “bury” the lower portion of the abutment? And where did all of that fill come from and why?

And if it was filled, how is it that just south of this location at Arthur Jasper’s house, the original LIMP pavement is still visible - at the same elevation as the regular ground?

I’m thinking my pictures might be of the wall on either side of the former abutments. Let the discussion begin!

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

I have friends that live on Russel Rd. they have the Motor Parkway ROW in the back of their yard.

From Sam & Dave’s Excellent Lost Motor Parkway Adventure III: The "Mayan Ruins" in Garden City

What a cool day-trip. Nothing lasts forever, and most are likely aware of, “This amazing 5-minute film documents the opening of the museum on August 27, 1948…”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fo6jh1T6nBo

Tom Gibson

From Hamptons Road Trip: A 1928 Renault Barn Find & Site of the Long Island Automotive Museum Up for Sale