Vanderbilt Cup Races

Hope to see you all tonite, weather permitting, if not, later on this month, after coming back from Geogia and Florida. I’ll be down that way, in Williamsburge Virgina, this Friday-Tuesday. Be seeing ya.

From Learn About The Treasures of the Vanderbilt Cup Races & the Motor Parkway

I’m still puzzled by this photo.  According to Ray Cunningham, president of the Homer Historical Society, this photo was taken by Wilbur Tudor, sometime in the [19] teens.  Wilbur Tudor lived in Homer Illinois, about 140 miles south of Chicago.  The Homer Historical Society has dozens of Tudor’s photos taken in the Homer area.  It seems likely then that the photo would have been taken somewhere in the midwest rather than in Connecticut, as some have suggested.

I thought that the photo might have been taken while it was making the rounds of the Locomobile showrooms, perhaps at the Chicago branch, during 1909 or 1910 but in the photo, the car appears to be wearing black tires.  Photos taken during the 1908 Vanderbilt Cup race as well as one showing the car on display with the NY to Paris Thomas Flyer in 1909, in NY, show the car wearing white tires (albeit often quite dirty).  This suggests that the photo was taken sometime later, after the tires had been changed.

From Mystery Friday Foto #9: Can You Identify This Old 16 Locomobile Photo?

Wow. Being a former Lilco employee, I’m familiar with the substation property that pretty much covers the area of the former Karatsonyi property. Just had no idea of the history here. It’s good to learn something new, thanks guys.

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

Thanks for those links Frank. You thought I forgot about you guys, never happen, been busy lately, don’t have much time to keep in touch.

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

This the French team competing in the 1905 Vanderbilt Cup. Six persons, so they could be the fully ‘French’ equipes of Lorraine-Dietrich (Arthur Duray with mechanician Franville), Renault ( Ferenç Szisz with Dimitrievic) and Darracq (Victor Hémery with unknown mechanician). Unfortunately the quality of the photo is insufficient for good recognition, but the person on the far left could be Hémery and on the far right Duray.

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

Though not affecting its performance, the racer’s block is cracked and use is limited by the museum.

Responses:

ED MINNIE · December 16, 2012 at 9:27 pm
Dave, Last time I was at the Henery Ford I was told the block was cracked on OLD 16 and they will no longer run it. It this correct? Ed Minnie

Reply
DAVID GREENLEES · December 17, 2012 at 7:03 am
Ed, Yes Old 16 is now silent as the conservators at the Henry Ford discovered small cracks starting at the top of some of the cylinders. They could very well have been there for years and are not affecting its operation, but in the interest of not causing any harm to this “Mona Lisa” of American treasures they made the decision to at least for now not run it.

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=65910

From Mystery Friday Foto #9: Can You Identify This Old 16 Locomobile Photo?

Unable to locate this structure in time. Closest guess is the Bulls Head Hotel before the large porch was removed on North Hempstead Tpke (Northern Blvd) and Back Road (Glen Cove Road) Greenvale, NY

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

From Edward G.
Thank you very much for this.  Ed.

From Book "Ways of the World": Long Island Motor Parkway Documented as the First Parkway in the World

-Identify this Vanderbilt Cup Race team
The 1905 French Darracq & Company racing team (Cup winner, Victor Hemery and second place finisher Louis Wagner).

-What is the approximate date of the photo?
Oct. 1905

-Where was the team headquarters located?
Hotel Glenwood Hungaria in Glenwood Landing.  Owned by Karatsonyi and Kmetz. 
More information and pictures to be sent to Howard separately about this location.

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

~  Oct 14, 1905 during the Vanderbilt Cup Race
French Team on the balcony, Somewhere, Long Island (still looking)

1904 VCR Oct 8, 1904
1 George Heath       Panhard           French   90hp Avg 52.2mph
2 Albert Clement Jr.  Clement-Bayard   French   90hp Avg 52.0mph
3 Herb Lytle           Pope-Toledo     US       24hp Avg 40.0mph

1905 VCR Oct 14, 1905
1 Victor Hemery       Darracq           French   80hp Avg 61.5mph
2 George Heath       Panhard           French 120hp Avg 60.7mph
3 Joe Tracy           Locomobile       US         90hp Avg 56.9mph

http://www.vanderbiltcupraces.com/races/year/1905_vanderbilt_cup_race

http://digitalcollections.detroitpubliclibrary.org/islandora/object/islandora:182240

https://books.google.com/books?id=jDcjAQAAMAAJ&pg=RA1-PA132&lpg=RA1-PA132&dq=1905+vanderbilt+cup+race+french+team&source=bl&ots=TLpDiy6wKz&sig=jV9UGmrr7Ph2hyNscUFn0ZN3n0w&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RpnzVNGLKtL-yQSvtIKQDw&ved=0CEUQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=1905 vanderbilt cup race french team&f=false

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

From Ron B.:

I recently purchased copies of your Vanderbilt Cup Races and Long Island Motor Parkway in conjunction with my research on classic speedsters for a book that I am writing. I also subscribe to your blog.

I was reading your bio and noticed that you own a 66 GT350. I am a member of SAAC and own a 65 K-code fastback that I have used for concours competitions. Great cars to drive! Now, however, I am looking for an old speedster to work on, so will probably sell the Mustang to make room.

I just wanted to drop you a line to compliment you on the fine work you are doing in covering the Vanderbilt Cup races. I know it is a lot of work, but you are filling in an important historical gap in American automotive history. Hats off to you, sir.

From Book "Ways of the World": Long Island Motor Parkway Documented as the First Parkway in the World

Whoops!  Several problems here.  No mention of Buenos Aires’s very early (possibly pre-LIMP) parkway; Italy’s opened only slightly later than LIMP.  No LIMP auto ramps in the Newbridge Road photo; only a construction ramp.  The LIMP did NOT start out as asphalt!  “Today’s” Woodland MNRR area.  GWMP photo ca, 1950, NOT 1930 (check white car)!  Sorry ‘bout that/  Sam, III
_____________________________________________
From Howard Kroplick I

Sam III, thanks!

From Book "Ways of the World": Long Island Motor Parkway Documented as the First Parkway in the World

VERY INTERESTING STORY.  I REMEMBER PASSING THE CANTRELL FACTORY LOCATED NEAR THE RR TRACKS OFF PULASKI ROAD IN HUNTINGTON STATION.  I REMEMBER ALL THE STATION WAGONS PARKED OUTSIDE. THIS WAS AFTER WW11. I WAS ABOUT 10 YEARS OF AGE.
MY HOUSE IN HUNTINGTON IS LOCATED A SHORT DISTANCE FROM WHERE CANTRELL FAMILY HOME WAS .  MY SISTERS GIRL FRIEND BOUGHT THE CANTRELL HOUSE AND THEY TOLD OF ALL THE WOOD PIECES STORED IN THE BASEMENT.

From Long Island Auto Manufacturers & Body Builders #2: J.T. Cantrell & Company of Huntington Part II

That’s the French Race Team on Long Island for the 1905 Vanderbilt Cup Race so the date would probably be around the first 2 weeks of October, 1905. As to location, just a wild guess but someplace on the north shore of Nassau County, maybe Glen Cove or Seacliff.

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

To me, the 3rd person from the left looks like Louis Wagner. If that’s true, it must be 1905 or 1906 and the other people are presumably part of the Darracq entourage.

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

Howard- you and your team…your presentations, collection, is more than 5 STAR, Elaine and plan to get out to Long Island, when it warms up, ands the fishing gets going…we will be at Amelia…seeya?  Thanks …Oscar cell 570 430 1615
__________________________________

Oscar, thanks for the comment. I will be at Amelia this year with Chrysler’s Chrysler.

From Starting Lineup: The 1911 Vanderbilt Cup Race, Savannah, Georgia

Well, with that hill, it sure wasn’t Savannah!

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

Photo possibly taken when racer was held at the Grand Palace in New York City. (Image from ‘The Automobile’, January 21, 1909), though the objects on this side of the room don’t match the mystery photo. http://theoldmotor.com/?p=98090

From Mystery Friday Foto #9: Can You Identify This Old 16 Locomobile Photo?

-Identify this Vanderbilt Cup Race team
#18 Darracq driven by Victor Hemery with Victor Demogeot as mechanician

-What is the approximate date of the photo?
October 1905

-Where was the team headquarters located?
Glenwood hotel in Sea Cliff

From Mystery Foto #9 B Solved:The 1905 Darracq Team Headquartered at the Hotel Glenwood, Glenwood Landing

Nice enlargement of the tire ad, that wasn’t possible back in 2013. The artists’ signature can be clearly seen! If memory fails, I believe it was Mr. Helck that stated this mystery garage was not the one in Bristol.

From Mystery Friday Foto #9: Can You Identify This Old 16 Locomobile Photo?