Vanderbilt Cup Races

Al, I also now agree with your assessment of the second bridge photo being demolition and not construction.
Aside from your comments on the visible reinforcing wire, the lower, smooth part of the abutment looks to be weathered with even some mature foliage at the very lower edge of the photo. There also appears to be something painted on the abutment on the lower right but partially obscured by a wooden post. My best guess is that it original wording was ‘post no bills’, which of course would not already be painted on a partially constructed abutment. The wooden scaffolding in the background were not forms as originally thought, but probably placed to avoid the embankment soil from collapsing once the abutment is completely removed

From Updated: Mystery Foto #17 Solved: The Meadowbrook Polo Club Bridge over the Motor Parkway

Your theory of the the new polo fields bridge to the East side of the old Roosevelt Field bridge would dictate that there had to be some sort of worn path crossing the dirt path leading to, and away from the Roosevelt bridge. Horses could walk the dirt path to the West of the new paved road, then, just before the rise of the South embankment, or just after the rise of the North embankment, they cross over the dirt Roosevelt Field pathway towards the polo fields. Below are two spots I have identified them possibly doing just that. See below in my photos, the spots where this could have been are crudely marked by my arrows.
But I think the most conclusive are the demo plans;
You can see the differences in sizes of the bridges on the plans as well as the blown up aerial I posted in my last comment above. On the plans of the proposed bridge to demolish, the smaller of the two bridges shows horse gates at the end of the North embankment of the East bridge. Interestingly, there are are gates leading out to the East, North, and yes, to the West towards the polo fields. Property ownership marked on the plans determines direction.
So, I think this may the most proof of your theory that we have so far. While illogical to place the bridges on the opposite sides of where their destinations are, I am now leaning towards your thinking.

From Updated: Mystery Foto #17 Solved: The Meadowbrook Polo Club Bridge over the Motor Parkway

Al, as promised after our discussion, I looked into this further, but like you, didn’t come up with any conclusive documentation, but the more I look at various photos, I do see a little more evidence to help your theory. Honestly, I was a bit skeptical when you first said it, but here’s my 2 cents since at the moment, there’s no definite conclusion.

As I mentioned when we spoke, I had doubts about the Erie paving hopper being on the North side of the bridge. I also noticed that the hopper looked like it was beyond the existing bridge behind the new bridge being built in the photo. Also, looking at photos and aerials from 1936ish, the new VCR racetrack is on the East side and the polo fields are to the West side, logic would say it just doesn’t make sense to place the new bridge intended for the polo fields that are to the East side of the old Roosevelt Field bridge. Also, a grass/dirt path from the stables to the polo fields seemed more appropriate than a paved road for the horses. In the blow up of the twin bridges below, I noticed the West bridge was slightly wider and had much taller sides which also seemed more appropriate for horses as well. Looking at the next photo below, it also looked like a straight paved road to the VCR racetrack, and the dirt path from the West bridge came off the bridge and curved slightly right into the parameter road of the polo fields. Initially, I theorized that they paved a new road leading to the old bridge, (replacing the split path/road seen in the 1927 Lindbergh photo), to update the old 1908 bridge into a new entrance for the new VCR racetrack. The hopper for paving materials being closer to the older, existing bridge supported that thought in my mind. (Thereby placing that hopper on the South side of the LIMP in the McCamish photo) However, a few things popped up that further support your narrative and not mine. I think some of the most conclusive evidence can be found on the demo plans that Art had dug up below. See my next post with further photos…

From Updated: Mystery Foto #17 Solved: The Meadowbrook Polo Club Bridge over the Motor Parkway

Identify the exact location of the train, the LIRR track and orientation of the photographer. Provide a rationale.
The train is west of the Motor Parkway bridge but east of the Nassau Interlocking in Mineola on the LIRR Main Line.  Based on attached photos (signal 203 is shown on the north side of the tracks, and the caption on the 1978 photo indicating looking east) the electrical tower would be on the south side.  As such I would say the train is going east and the photographer is looking west - the train is on Track #1.

Identify the train. HO 112
Name all the bridges that went over the Motor Parkway.
What was the approximate year of the Mystery Foto? Provide a rationale.  1940s

From Mystery Foto #18 Solved : A Train Passing the Mineola LIRR Motor Parkway Bridge Heading East

Howard, While we are still on the Otto McCamish family photos. Regarding the second bridge photo taken by Otto McCamish. I think it’s a photo of the demolition of one of the embankments.  Note the wire reinforcing is visible and attached to a jagged angled edge of concrete The wire reinforcing is not visible during the pouring of cement. That’s only possible with demolition. Note the exterior of the embankment wall at the bottom of the photo. not exactly a good pour.

From Updated: Mystery Foto #17 Solved: The Meadowbrook Polo Club Bridge over the Motor Parkway

Howard,  Great mystery photo, never saw it before. Question, on the right side of the image there is a pole. At the top there is what looks like an arrow pointing straight up. Any idea if the arrow was movable and supplied the train operator with information?

From Mystery Foto #18 Solved : A Train Passing the Mineola LIRR Motor Parkway Bridge Heading East

Frank,The reasoning for my opinion that the east bridge is the Meadow Brook Club bridge is based mostly on the 1936 photo and the 1929 Lindbergh photo. The 1936 photo clearly only one well defined, paved, and new looking road to Stewart Ave. Yes, in that photo there is an unpaved pathway on the west side of the paved road also leading to Stewart Ave. But in the 1929 Lindbergh photo that road doesn’t go straight to Stewart Ave. I believe that path, north from Stewart Ave to the west bridge, was created by the horses and their handlers walking from the stables that were located on the Meadow BrooK Club property south of Stewart Ave ,. to the new polo fields. When the Meadow Brook Club purchased the polo field property and the strip south to Stewart Ave., they also purchased from Lannin, property south of Stewart Ave reaching to the LIRR tracks This gave the Club a straight direct approach over the tracks to the fields. While typing this, it occurred to me that approach is probably today, without any research, today’s Endo Blvd. Anyone ?

From Updated: Mystery Foto #17 Solved: The Meadowbrook Polo Club Bridge over the Motor Parkway

I think it is a train going east into HICKSVILLE with th bridge near mineola in the background

My guess

From Mystery Foto #18 Solved : A Train Passing the Mineola LIRR Motor Parkway Bridge Heading East

I think we’re looking east on the LIRR Mainline in Mineola between Roslyn Road and Glen Cove Road. I believe that’s the only LIMP bridge that crosses over two tracks at the same time. Not sure, but I think that’s a G5-S locomotive. Since steam service ended on the LIRR around 1955, I think this photo is a little earlier, maybe the year I was born: 1947. Near as I could determine, there were 17 bridges that went over the LIMP: Creedmoor; Smith Farmway; Old Courthouse Road; Wheatley Hills “Golfway”; Jericho Turnpike (Mineola); Old Country Road; Meadow Brook Polo Club; Roosevelt Field (Sheeps Pen Road); Stewart Avenue; Carman Avenue; Jerusalem Avenue; Bloomingdale Road; Nibbe Farmway; Powell Avenue; Plainview Road; Botto Farmway; Exekiel Smith Farmway (Maxess Rd.).

From Mystery Foto #18 Solved : A Train Passing the Mineola LIRR Motor Parkway Bridge Heading East

I have a vaguely related question.  Into the 1990s, there was a building that could be seen from Merrick Avenue sort of near Stewart Ave. and the Meadowbrook Parkway interchange.  It may also have been vaguely visible from the Meadowbrook parkway.  It appeared to be abandoned, and seemed to be made of brownish yellow brick and maybe tile.  Does anyone know what it was?  Was it connected somehow to the Polo Club?  I had the impression that it was an old nightclub, but I may be mistaken.  It was torn down sometime in the 1990s, I think.
______________________________________________________________________
Howard Kroplick
Tim, is it one of these buildings: https://www.vanderbiltcupraces.com/blog/article/mystery_friday_foto_33_yet_another_spectacular_aerial_of_the_long_island_mo

From Updated: Mystery Foto #17 Solved: The Meadowbrook Polo Club Bridge over the Motor Parkway

I’ll stay out of this one - too much commonality of interests - without cheating.  Wild guess would be LIRR Main Line in Carle Place looking west with OCR at right.  There are few places where the LIMP crossed the LIRR at a right angle.  But I am taken by an odd detail; the height (or lack thereof) of the telephone/telegraph poles to the left of ol’ 111.  Sure seems unlikely that the flatland on either side of the RR RoW would be at differing grades.  Sam, III

From Mystery Foto #18 Solved : A Train Passing the Mineola LIRR Motor Parkway Bridge Heading East

Spent quite a bit of time exploring that area with my son Gram about 7 years ago. The homeless situation was a factor but that even reminded me of my own explorations of the parkway in the Alley Pond area back when I was a young boy in the 50s. In those days we would come upon a few hobo camps thriving in the relative secrecy of the Queens park system. Those camps disappeared as work started on the Clearview Expressway.

From Sammy & Dave's "Excellent 2020 Vanderbilt Day": Scouting the South Side of Westbury Avenue in Mineola/Carle Place

Hey, Art!  Is Howard paying you overtime?  You sure deserve it.  The two danger points are both RR crossings.  OMG!  The “Victory” Monument (as I knew of it) - I’d forgotten all about that one, too; it impressed me as a kid then - gone.  Keep it coming!  Sam, III

From Kleiner's Korner: The Motor Parkway in Maps - Part IV

Robert Y:

Dear Howard

I am a South African motoring historian (hobby that is ) but presently ‘stuck’ in New Zealand under lockdown.
I devour any old motor sport information and recently Dave Evans sent me two lovely books or pre war racing that mentioned the vanderbilt races.
I must admit that the races were well known to me but your site has expanded what knowledge i had.
The more so in these difficult times we are enduring.
Many thanks for sharing knowlege with us via your efforts.
They are certainly appreciated.
Kind regards

From COVID-19 Vaccine Links

Craig Roman has forward this drone video of the current condition of the Port Washington Seaplane Terminal location.

From Update: Beutenmuller Family Collection #1: Searching for the Port Washington Seaplane Terminals

There’s so much to enjoy with this photo. (I had a Lionel train set as a kid with a locomotive that looked like this engine).  My guess is mid-1930s.  There are so many LIRR straight-aways (still exist), so could be anywhere: Mineola line heading out past Hicksville along flat terrain of center Long Island.

From Mystery Foto #18 Solved : A Train Passing the Mineola LIRR Motor Parkway Bridge Heading East

*Location & Orientation:  PRR Steam Engine hauling freight north & possibly east along the Oyster Bay Branch. Believe the train is just north of IU Willets Rd, Albertson NY.This Branch begins north from Mineola. The LIMP overpass with the transmission tower nearby is in East Williston.

*LIMP & LIRR crossings:  Central Ave, Bethpage - Mineola - East Williston. Trolley - Broad Hollow Rd, Westbury Ave, Mineola/Willis Ave.

*Date:  I’ll say 1935.

From Mystery Foto #18 Solved : A Train Passing the Mineola LIRR Motor Parkway Bridge Heading East

From Art Kleiner:
Craig, fantastic footage showing the range of possibilities with drones these days to help document our preservation efforts.  Perhaps one day we can discuss other locations that might warrant a fly-over.

From Flying Boat/Seaplane of the Week: Sikorsky S-42B Pan American Clipper III (NC-16736)

The last and final map publish in 1928, has the labeling of Rt. 25 and 25A in reverse order.

From Kleiner's Korner: The Motor Parkway in Maps - Part IV

I went and took a flyover today.  In retrospect, I should have focused more on the property.  I was enamored with the clarity of the water.

https://youtu.be/v0UH3In5Xi0

From Flying Boat/Seaplane of the Week: Sikorsky S-42B Pan American Clipper III (NC-16736)