Vanderbilt Cup Races

Here’s another attempt at a race course on a Long Island beach that never materialized.  From the “Automotor Journal” of April 15, 1905.

From Kleiner's Korner: Long Beach Gets a Race in 1906 (Or Does It?)

Thanks, Frank; I missed that one.  This just adds to my point.  Getting to pixellation, you can’t see any demarcation between the south verge of NB/HHB and the LIMP entry ramp.  Those missing pix showed just that from the ground - a continuous entry from the west.  Is a puzzlement.  Sam, III

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge

Back to the VCR - there’s detail of Florida’s crash in the linked 05 Dec 2013 blog post, “Chaos at the Finish of the 1908 Vanderbilt Cup Race”, but it says he hit a roadster “carrying two girls and a driver”.  The photo seems to me to show FOUR people.  How about a new thread about that accident (or reopening the 2013 one); there MUST be far more info. available.  I thought we’d already covered it here but I can’t find any such.  Sam, III

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Sam, check out Al’s amazing 1938 aerial of the western terminus below, stretching to 194 St., and possibly beyond. The distance measured from the former CRR RoW to the LIMP Row was only 60 feet, center to center. The LIMP entrance ramp off Nassau Blvd was ~230 feet at its widest, and narrowed as it approached the kiosk. It was 22 feet width thereafter.   

Bruce, my best guess, the LIMP entrance was just east of Peck Ave, alongside the current ped overpass. The LIMP roadway ran through the middle of the school.

Al’s aerial was found here:
https://www.vanderbiltcupraces.com/blog/article/the_motor_parkway_western_terminus_in_fresh_meadows_curca_1938

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge

Amazing detective work by all. This one was out of my scope.

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Based on Ariejan Bos’ comment, I have revised the answers to last week’s Mystery Foto.

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Indy driver Hughie Hughes DID look like both!  If it wasn’t for my whiskers, with enough oil and road grime, I’d probably look like all of ‘em, too!  Sam, III

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

I can understand, see attached photograph of Stillman at the wheel of a Marmon. Myself I was convinced that the driver was Hugh Hughes, but I couldn’t make a Mercer from that steering wheel.

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Well, it sure LOOKED like a pic of Stillman which I now can’t locate but I did turn up this amazing Western Movie & TV Photos image of Buck Jones at Indy!  Sam, III

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Amazing to me how there don’t seem to be any good OLD aerials of the terminus area WEST of 198th or thereabouts.  I’d like to see the area of HHB around 194th to 198th, with its border of heavy trees and the margin on the south side, say around 1926-28.  Anyone?  Sam, III

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge

A nice aerial from the site here.

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge

Although I always check your site on a daily basis, I normally do not compete in the weekly quizzes as they are either outside my scope of interest or too easy. This time I tried, but it appeared not possible for me to find a solution. As I suspected the car to be a Vanderbilt participant, I tried to match the steering wheel to the cars, but failed. Now I know the name of the driver I understand why. As we see James Florida, and the car must be a Locomobile, it cannot be the Vanderbilt racer because of the different steering wheel configuration. Looking a bit further it is now clear for me that we see James Florida during the Fairmount Park races in Philadelphia, 26th September 1908, where he (and also George Robertson) drove a different type of Locomobile racer, the type I 4-40, which was in fact a standard production model and which fits with the steering wheel configuration. Florida would finish on 5th place, Robertson was the winner.

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Here’s a screenshot of Frank’s online map zoomed to the western terminus. The red line is the Central RR ROW.

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge

Going on quick guesses this weekend; Joe/Jim Florida in the #1Locomobile, 1908 races.

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Based on the sweater, I’m guessing a Locomobile but after that I’ve come up empty. Looking forward the answer.

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

Bruce, pin pointing the very exact location of the western terminus of the Motor Parkway at the LIE. is a little tricky The City had acquired a 160 feet wide swath of land for what was originally Nassau Blvd. later renamed H.H. Blvd. At the time the Parkway reached Nassau Blvd., only the center part of that roadway was developed, (roughly 40 feet wide ), so some guess work is involved. but… after studying many maps, surveys, photos and drawings, I put it closest to today’s 195th St. and I’m willing to go out on a limb and put it at the east bound middle lane of the L.I.E One needs to look at the L.I. E. construction drawings of the area to get a clearer picture.

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge

That’s Harry Stillman in Olds #20 in the 1910 VCR.  Can’t readily find his mech. - odd.  Kudos - fugeddaboudit!  Sam, III

From Update Mystery Foto #35 Solved: Jim Florida in the #9 Locomobile at the 1908 Founders Week Cup Race

What a blast; thanks muchly, Art!  The list of names is fab., but what struck me most was NOT automotive; it was Messrs. P(rosper). Clust and (Col.) C(harles). J(oseph). Dieges!  Bet they furnished the cuff links and scarf pins (and maybe the bronze statue); Dieges & Clust was the firm that made all my grade and high school and college (and association) rings and pins!  They were famed for medals and plaques.  Wonder if they also made car emblems and badges.  Sam, III

From Kleiner's Korner: Fred Wagner Hosting a 1915 Party

Bruce, I’m one of those (if the only one) who claims it was further west, say around 193 (see <http://sbiii.com/limp-qns.html#westterm>.  Al V. said it was at 195th.  I maintain the entry was between the row of trees and the HHB pavement.  My site has many old photos of the area but they’re scattered (or lost); the 73rd St. bridge in 1955 and 2001 is on <http://sbiii.com/limp-qn2.html> and the area and bridge especially in 2002 on <http://sbiii.com/limp-qn1.html> and in 2008 on <http://sbiii.com/limp-qn3.html>.  Wherever the entry was, it was definitely westward along the south margin of Horace Harding Boulevard, NOT south of it, although the toll gate itself and the kiosk WERE located some 300’-400’ to the southeast; this may account for some of the confusion.  The 05 May 2018 blog post shows the entry ca. 1938.  CHALLENGE - LIers - has anyone checked in detail on the ground around Peck Ave. just southeast of the merge with HHB?  Google Maps shows all sorts of interesting traces (possibly just sidewalks - see attached).  Sam, III

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge

Exactly where was the actual entrance on today’s streets?  I envisioned it somewhere near the L.I.E. at 199th, but I recall someone had said it was in the Garden Apartments west of 199th Street. That seems to differ from Al’s map.  Thank you

From Then & Now- The Western Terminus to the 73rd Avenue Motor Parkway Bridge